Friday, January 06, 2006

The Country's Coming Back

I just heard this story on Rush- A new national poll shows that High School seniors take a pro-life position and favor legislation limiting abortions. Here are some of the results: When asked, some 67 percent of high school seniors said abortion is either always (23%) or usually (44%) morally wrong. Just 31 percent said it was a morally correct decision. Slightly less than half of the teens polled said abortions should be allowed when a woman is under 18 and unmarried or when the baby will have a serious birth defect. Just 40 percent said abortions should be allowed for poor women and only 29 percent said abortions should be allowed when a woman doesn't want more children. Some 72 percent of teen girls say they would not consider an abortion and, of all high school seniors, just 13 percent would counsel a pregnant friend to consider an abortion. Some 54 percent of seniors say they would suggest adoption and 26 percent say they would encourage a pregnant friend to keep her baby. These are great results...which I believe have partly sprung up from abstinence only education and more conservative sex-ed techniques across the country. Theres some argument a couple posts ago on the effectiveness of abstinence only education.


At 1/06/2006 03:12:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Who was the poll done by

At 1/06/2006 03:16:00 PM, Blogger Willis said...

TC is fully indoctrinated.

At 1/06/2006 03:16:00 PM, Blogger too conservative said...

Hamilton College

At 1/06/2006 03:21:00 PM, Blogger Involved said...

Excellent News! This is only natural, due to pro-life people having children, and the pro-baby-killers destroying all of theirs!

Your numbers tend to dwindle when you are a member of the party of death!

At 1/06/2006 03:21:00 PM, Blogger Willis said...

Well, look at this. 2/3 of high school seniors favor allowing gay marriage legally.

This poll was done by the same college as TC's poll was.

Whaddya think about this, TC?

At 1/06/2006 03:24:00 PM, Blogger Willis said...

Also, I'd like to note that in the same article TC linked, the majority of the students favor keeping abortion legal.

I have no problem with students being personally against abortion, if those same students agree that a woman has the right to choose.

At 1/06/2006 03:31:00 PM, Blogger Mitch Cumstein said...

First, I don't think that these results necessarily have anything to do with teaching abstinence-only in schools. Maybe, just maybe, the fact that we're actually teaching our kids all of the information and not just a bunch of morality-based drivel is making them think in a more responsible way?

Willis makes a very interesting observation with the other polling data. It sounds like the majority of teens feel that abortion would not be a moral choice for themselves but stop short of telling others that the can't be free to make their own choices. Sounds like a bunch of budding moderates to me! You're right, TC, maybe "The Counrty's Coming Back!"

At 1/06/2006 03:34:00 PM, Blogger J.Sarge said...

I think we should all be pleased that young adults are steering away from abortion. One hopes that is because fewer are finding themselves in a position where they have to make a choice.

Safer sexual activity is on the rise. Teens are choosing to engage in alternative forms of sexual contact, such as oral sex, rather than risk pregnancy. Interestingly, oral sex was illegal in Virginia until Lawrence v. Texas came down from the "activist" U.S. Supreme Court.

What I believe this shows is that teens are smart. They have learned how to have safer, protected sex and how to avoid putting themselves in situations where pregnancy is more likely to occur. This isn't a product of abstinance only education - it's a product of responsible sex education: abstinance is the safest measure, some alternatives are riskier than others.

The danger now, of course, is that teens may need additional education on the disease-transmission possibilities of oral sex. This, I fear, will be a more difficult battle.

As for abstinance being the only surefire way to prevent pregnancy - I've never heard of a gay couple getting pregnant by mistake. Maybe they are on to something...

At 1/06/2006 03:38:00 PM, Blogger too conservative said...

I saw that as well Willis-

I feel the poll is accurate.

I believe my generation is more tolerent of people, and more respectful of life in general.

To be honest..I do not have an intense strong opinion on the gay issue. I feel they shouldnt be married, but I am confused..because they are people too..who I believe deserve to be happy.

Even at the National Teenage Republican convention this past summer..teen republican leaders from across the nation did not have strong opinions on this issue.

At the risk of being attacked..I believe it's kind of a Gay people are going to live together anyways without the consent of the govenment.

Homosexuality has been going on for thousands and thousands of's obvious even back before the "liberal media" people have somehow or another been gay.

So willis-I would agree with both polls..and feel my generation will lead the nation in the right direction.

Lets look at the history of America...abortion is's not a civil right.

Conservatives can win on abortion..we cant win on gay marriage.

As with women, and blacks..I believe homosexuals will eventually gain the right to marry regardless of what people say about it now.

As long as its not shoved in my face..I really don't care about it, and cant understand why people talk about such a non-issue.

At 1/06/2006 03:41:00 PM, Blogger too conservative said...

on another note..

we are all sons of god here on earth..why spend all of our time hating on people?

We could focus our attention on other things.

At 1/06/2006 03:44:00 PM, Blogger Willis said...

Glad you agree with me on that point, TC. It's going to happen eventually, just a question of when (gay marriage I mean).

I believe abortion will, in the end, be legal. I think you guys will eventually succeed in illegalizing it, but once you do that and experience the repercussions, the public will change their minds and go back to favoring it. That's what I think will happen there.

At 1/06/2006 03:48:00 PM, Blogger too conservative said...

I do not think it will ever be illegal..but as science evolved that we will scale it back.

Science can actually be used to help conservatives on this issue..showing just exactly then the baby has a beating heart(for example)..

We can count that as life..and maybe make all abortions after that certain time illegal.

We should also cut back drastically on just unwanted pregancies..95% of all abortions..but continue to allow rape/incest/life of the mother.

At 1/06/2006 04:01:00 PM, Blogger Willis said...

I wouldn't be against illegalizing abortion after a certain period, to tell the truth. Beyond certain circumstances (like when the father leaves the mother 6 months into the pregnancy, or so) I don't understand why a mother would wait 6 months to have an abortion anyway.

I think, once the baby is viable, abortion should be illegalized. So, we probably agree there.

But I do think that, eventually, you guys will succeed in illegalizing it. That's what Alito is for.

At 1/06/2006 04:06:00 PM, Blogger Lucy Jones said...

I have no problem with students being personally against abortion, if those same students agree that a woman has the right to choose.

Scary Willis, but I agree with you on this one...

At 1/06/2006 04:13:00 PM, Blogger Sam McCord said...

What about this paragraph:

"The poll found 62 percent of seniors want the Supreme Court to keep Roe v. Wade in place but gave respondents inaccurate information about the decision. The Hamilton College poll told those surveyed that the decision "guaranteed women the right to get an abortion in the first three months of pregnancy" -- though it actually allowed abortions throughout pregnancy for virtually any reason."

How much of that was LifeNews's spin on that number? I'd love to see the question but haven't been able to pick through all the complete reports on Hamilton's site to see if I can find it anywhere.

At 1/06/2006 04:17:00 PM, Blogger Willis said...

i'd say its spin. Sure sounds like it.

At 1/06/2006 04:43:00 PM, Blogger GOPHokie said...

I concur w/ TC that abortion will never be illegal everywhere in America. It will always be legal in some forms in places like Cali, NY and Massachusetts. Roe v Wade may be overturned and places like Idaho, Utah and even perhaps Virginia will outlaw it. Mostly we will see more late term abortion bans and parental notification laws, not outright bans on abortions.
As to gay marriage, I am not so sure it will ever be legal everywhere. Civil unions may be an almost universal standard in the future, but I doubt actual marriage will be granted in many states (but it will be NY, Mass and more liberal states such as those).

At 1/06/2006 04:51:00 PM, Blogger Willis said...

Once civil unions become law, marriage will soon follow.

Having "civil unions for homosexuals" and "marriage" for heterosexuals, even if they have the exact same economic benefits and stuff, is SEPERATE BUT EQUAL law.

No way it would stand for long.

At 1/06/2006 04:52:00 PM, Blogger Mitch Cumstein said...

My preference is that Roe not be overturned. If it is, my guess is that Virginia will move to ban abortions, but Maryland won't. So, at least in NOVA, we'll see folks simply hop the northern border to get the "medical treatment" they choose.

I do support bans on late-term and partial birth abortions, as well as requiring parental notification.

Again, I think the key here is education. Regardless of your stand on the life vs. choice question, most believe that abortion is tragic. If we do our job in educating people to avoid unwanted pregnancies, the issue of abortion becomes moot.

At 1/06/2006 05:16:00 PM, Anonymous getagrip said...

Having "civil unions for homosexuals" and "marriage" for heterosexuals, even if they have the exact same economic benefits and stuff, is SEPERATE BUT EQUAL law.

I think it's the business community that will end up taking the lead here. What a nightmare - a patchwork of different civil union, domestic partnership and marriage frameworks that vary state to state, rather than a simple one size fits all institution, with full faith and credit.

At 1/06/2006 07:38:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

The question is this:

When does life begin?

Does life deserve to be protected from that point?

At 1/06/2006 07:48:00 PM, Blogger Willis said...

I don't think its right to force a mother to allow a parasite to feed off of her body when she doesn't want that to happen.

That is what anti-abortion legislation would amount to.

At 1/07/2006 02:13:00 AM, Blogger Too Moderate said...


When does the baby stop being a parasite and become a baby in your mind?

That is the question. No one says it is ok to kill a baby after birth (well not counting partial birth abortion), why? Because it is alive. Now when does that standard get applied?

I argue once life starts.

Now that is an argument in and of itself. When does life start? Is it conception, brainwaves, or birth? That is the question, not how was the baby conceived or can a woman do to her body what she wants. When you agree that it is two lives and not one, that is when those should not apply.

At 1/07/2006 03:30:00 AM, Blogger Willis said...

The baby is a parasite until it is viable outside the womb. Personally, I believe abortion should be legal up until birth can be induced with a reasonable expectation of a healthy baby being born.

At that point, instead of an abortion, birth can be induced and the baby can become a ward of the state.

At 1/07/2006 12:52:00 PM, Anonymous Elle said...

wdHi all, it's Elle. at the library and can't remember my login stuff...

TC, if you stopped abortions when the heart beats, then there wouldn't be any--as the heart beats at around 6 wks, I believe, and you can't have an abortion till around week 6 or 7.

And don't get too happy; once these high schoolers are away from mom and dad and start experimenting in college--I'll bet those opinions on abortion change. Where are these kids, anyway?

Willis, for once, I hope you're wrong. I hope abortion is never illegal! I can't imagine that we'd go that route again. I know too many girls, friends of mine when I was younger, who took lots of medicine,or many bc pills at once, or sat in tubs of hot water, or douched with questionable substances (and even one who perfected the old hanger trick on her second try), when they feared they might be pregnant. and i grew up in a not-so-poor, black community where "statistics" indicate most people would've been pro-life.
which leads me back to TC: Trust me, what these kids say and what they'll do in a certain situation are vastly different.

At 1/07/2006 01:19:00 PM, Blogger Too Moderate said...


viability or birth

Elle--they will think abortion is wrong until they are put in a position of taking care of a baby or killing the baby? It is easier to kill the baby right? I overheard a pol talking about stuff last cycle he said "the mind justifies what the heart has chosen" I have never heard something more true and it has stuck with me. Seems to be accurate here. How do we justify keeping our way of life? By changing our moral takes a lot of character to hold to your moral position once it is hard to do (pregnancy).

At 1/07/2006 08:32:00 PM, Blogger Willis said...


IMO, there is no justifiable reason to abort a baby once birth can be induced with a reasonable expectation of a healthy baby being born. The child could then be put up for adoption, the parents would have nothing to do with it, and some adoptive couple could get the baby they want.

So, viability. As of now, that would mean stopping all abortions where the beby is 6.5-7 months along. As technology progresses, that could change and get earlier.

At 1/07/2006 08:58:00 PM, Blogger Elle said...

TM-read your posts from earlier on homosexuality being a bad choice and your one above about "killing the baby," all of which leaves me with one question--how'd you get the name moderate?

my point was, especially in the case of younger women, theory and practice don't always match--it's easy to say "women shouldn't be having abortions" just as it is easy to say "teenagers shouldn't be having sex" (ha!). but, i believe that many young women faced with the consequences of interrupting their educational and social lives, possible stigma, and parental disappointment, abandon their black-and-white theories for shades-of-gray practices.


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